Show & Shine at the National

[RichardFX]

@Mazda mender

@RichardFX

I guess many of our members’ cars are like this, and don’t quite fit a category, and the owners are not quite able to spend enough time on the car to make it approach concourse…

 

Why do you assume it is all about concourse? none of the clubs show and shine comps have been centred around concourse, thats a different thing all together.

 

THERE IS A DAILY DRIVER SECTIONs, whats the issue.

 

As for spending enough time on their pride and a joys,go and have a look in the car parks at these events and view the hundreds of mazsters that will be parked up that owners have been sorting out weeks in advance to drive to a field and park them up un seen.

I think you are confusing the whole idea of the show and shine comps that are put on for you lot.

If no one wants to enter or offer to roll up their sleeves to help for the rest of the owners,not an issue, we can get on with other things…simples.

 

After every event there is always a lot of whinging that goes on, whinging from afar will not help or solve anything ,standing up and being counted will, and as said if more got of their ar*es , hey you never now what may happen.

Rhino skin helps every time.

M-m

Yes, alas, I am confusing it, because I was (still am) genuinely confused.

Having carefully read the judging manual it sure looked to me like the target for 100% was concourse.  So again a big off-put for a potential first timer.

And my car does not fit Daily Driver with too few miles, and the mods are so small it barely classes as Lightly Modded but it is no longer Standard.  This uncertainly is another reason not to bother.

But then I have never entered a competition of this kind, so know very little about it.  The high quality of presentation I have seen in previous MX5 club Rallies has been impressive, and a credit to all who entered. 

I support the idea of the competitions and have great respect for the volunteers who give so much time and energy to make them work, and admire those who can produce such beautiful cars to be judged. 

And as you say, so many of the other cars just in the car park are also immaculate, which is part of the great pleasure I’ve enjoyed in attending previous years - to see them all.

However things were taken out of my hands for this Rally, and there was no possibility of attending it let alone entering any competition.

 

[DonT]

@wolves mx5

Andrew

I had thought about entering mine but with my son off to university that weekend I didn’t feel I could be certain of attending.

I have a few similar minor mods (less) and would have felt like I had no choice than to have put mine into the same category as yours. There just wasn’t any other option that I could see. Having looked at the other cars I commented to a friend that I thought yours would win and at best , on a good day with a blind judge!, I might have had a chance of a 2nd.

As there are so few standard cars entered, at the moment, perhaps putting those cars with minor mods like yours in with those is an option?

It was certainly a hollow victory for the nice couple with the standard car as there was literally no competition whatsoever.

I believe the standard class should remain as it is, but perhaps just for NA,s

[wolves_mx5]

as there

@DonT

@wolves mx5

Andrew

I had thought about entering mine but with my son off to university that weekend I didn’t feel I could be certain of attending.

I have a few similar minor mods (less) and would have felt like I had no choice than to have put mine into the same category as yours. There just wasn’t any other option that I could see. Having looked at the other cars I commented to a friend that I thought yours would win and at best , on a good day with a blind judge!, I might have had a chance of a 2nd.

As there are so few standard cars entered, at the moment, perhaps putting those cars with minor mods like yours in with those is an option?

It was certainly a hollow victory for the nice couple with the standard car as there was literally no competition whatsoever.

I believe the standard class should remain as it is, but perhaps just for NA,s

Don, To a great extent I totally agree. The suggestion was purely based on the numbers issue. Although it applies to all NA, NB and NC’s

Ideally the club would be seeing, say at least 5 Cars for each Mk, in each category. However, If the numbers aren’t sufficient and are as low as just one car, then it surely makes sense to combine the competitions? The decision would perhaps even have to be made on the day dependant on who/how many turned up.

Until the numbers rise (as Mk3 get older that may change) there is little point organising a competition for one or two cars. For some people It can actually be counter productive to have few entrants. One of the guys I was with, who has a very clean early Mk3, was discouraged from entering in the future if there was only ever going to be one other standard car to compete against.

Personally I’d only want to take part if there were a few cars there as well.

 

[Andrew_calcutt]

A standard car should be as it left the factory.Any options that were factory fitted are ok.Any bits of chrome or upgraded stereos etc should have points knocked off,do not try to make things so complicated 

[wolves_mx5]

@Andrew calcutt

A standard car should be as it left the factory.Any options that were factory fitted are ok.Any bits of chrome or upgraded stereos etc should have points knocked off,do not try to make things so complicated 

Not really sure what your point Is? Clearly a standard car is as it left the factory. Chrome bit obviously get points knocked off.

If there aren’t many cars competing then its not a competition… How is that complicated?

[steve_mac]

I think the club and the car has become a victim of it’s success, with so many parts / upgrades available for all mk’s it is now causing arguments/ confusion as regards whether a part is an upgrade or a modification, a possible solution to this is to create a new list such as 

1.Daily driver ( as before )

2.Standard ( as before )

3. Slight upgrade ( up to 5 upgrades ,this can be for example, any blingy bits , HT leads ,painted calipers etc ) 

4.Unlimited upgrades ( as much as an owner wishes to do but is not a modification.

5.Slightly modified ( Brakes ,wheels, exhaust, suspension ,)

6.Unlimited modified ( Turbo’s , supercharger ,body kits etc etc )

Obviously I don’t know how much work this would involve only Mal can answer that but it would make the classess clearer…and hopefully stop everyone whinging 

Whatever the outcome becomes of this both me and my son will continue to support the club and all the administrator’s and back room staff in future events.

[Mazda_mender]

@steve mac

I think the club and the car has become a victim of it’s success, with so many parts / upgrades available for all mk’s it is now causing arguments/ confusion as regards whether a part is an upgrade or a modification, a possible solution to this is to create a new list such as 

1.Daily driver ( as before )

2.Standard ( as before )

3. Slight upgrade ( up to 5 upgrades ,this can be for example, any blingy bits , HT leads ,painted calipers etc ) 

4.Unlimited upgrades ( as much as an owner wishes to do but is not a modification.

5.Slightly modified ( Brakes ,wheels, exhaust, suspension ,)

6.Unlimited modified ( Turbo’s , supercharger ,body kits etc etc )

Obviously I don’t know how much work this would involve only Mal can answer that but it would make the classess clearer…and hopefully stop everyone whinging 

Whatever the outcome becomes of this both me and my son will continue to support the club and all the administrator’s and back room staff in future events.

Ste i get your point, but the only problem is that we have already sat around tables debating all this many many moons ago to get to the point to the sections we have, because otherwise we end up with so many sections, it all becomes stupid as where does it stop and end, the biggest classes will always be the lightly modded, until we get in restoring time and then it will become standard and concourse, and that is a fact, it is slowly starting now as i see the market on the cars change, the standard of these cars is high as we work on them and judge etc, which is credit to the owners that have the passion, wen are not stupid and no our stuff.

M-m

 

 

 

 

 

[Mazda_mender]

@RichardFX

@Mazda mender

@RichardFX

I guess many of our members’ cars are like this, and don’t quite fit a category, and the owners are not quite able to spend enough time on the car to make it approach concourse…

 

Why do you assume it is all about concourse? none of the clubs show and shine comps have been centred around concourse, thats a different thing all together.

 

THERE IS A DAILY DRIVER SECTIONs, whats the issue.

 

As for spending enough time on their pride and a joys,go and have a look in the car parks at these events and view the hundreds of mazsters that will be parked up that owners have been sorting out weeks in advance to drive to a field and park them up un seen.

I think you are confusing the whole idea of the show and shine comps that are put on for you lot.

If no one wants to enter or offer to roll up their sleeves to help for the rest of the owners,not an issue, we can get on with other things…simples.

 

After every event there is always a lot of whinging that goes on, whinging from afar will not help or solve anything ,standing up and being counted will, and as said if more got of their ar*es , hey you never now what may happen.

Rhino skin helps every time.

M-m

Yes, alas, I am confusing it, because I was (still am) genuinely confused.

Having carefully read the judging manual it sure looked to me like the target for 100% was concourse.  So again a big off-put for a potential first timer.

And my car does not fit Daily Driver with too few miles, and the mods are so small it barely classes as Lightly Modded but it is no longer Standard.  This uncertainly is another reason not to bother.

But then I have never entered a competition of this kind, so know very little about it.  The high quality of presentation I have seen in previous MX5 club Rallies has been impressive, and a credit to all who entered. 

I support the idea of the competitions and have great respect for the volunteers who give so much time and energy to make them work, and admire those who can produce such beautiful cars to be judged. 

And as you say, so many of the other cars just in the car park are also immaculate, which is part of the great pleasure I’ve enjoyed in attending previous years - to see them all.

However things were taken out of my hands for this Rally, and there was no possibility of attending it let alone entering any competition.

 

more than happy to have a chat over the phone to explain, far easier than tappy tap on here buddy.

M-m

[Pseudo_Pro]

Hmmmm? This isnt why I joined the club nor why I entered in the competition. I can totally see the frustration though. I find the MXOC to a be close knit community, especially NE Midlands. It’s mainly a couples thing with regards to the events etc.

After reading this thread and the bitter unprofessional sarcastic responses, I wont be renewing membership next year.

My gripe on the day is the paperwork was unreadable! Everything had gone through on the carbon paper so I didnt know what was scored or not?? Also, only one of my sheets had been totaled up and with the others unreadable it’s impossible to know what was scored etc?

I also felt the competition cars were tucked out of sight? Should have been up by the main arena as I was also one of the 2 who didnt know what was happening with the awards or whatever took place?

Very disappointed.

[richardn]

@Ma5da

Why not  have maybe a public vote as to which cars should win, a members favourite, most improved,best restoration etc etc.

That way club members are not taking flack for making a decision.

 

Because it is the best known guy that wins and it is not a fair competition based on the turn out of the car…it has been tried and failed miserably

[Ma5da]

@richardn

@Ma5da

Why not  have maybe a public vote as to which cars should win, a members favourite, most improved,best restoration etc etc.

That way club members are not taking flack for making a decision.

 

Because it is the best known guy that wins and it is not a fair competition based on the turn out of the car…it has been tried and failed miserably

Why should that be the case?

If all “competition cars” are in a certain area and each person coming through the gate gets a vote then the favourite car will be voted best in show or whatever.

Then how about entrants say in the MK1 class mark the MK2 and visa versa throughout the different classes.

 

 

[OlySparkes]

Mx5 owners club members are typically known for their chromed up 5 and It seems to me that because a chromed up mx5 didn’t get a top 3 in the mk3 lightly modified category at the spring rally because the newer generation of members are starting to stand their ground against the chromies 

what is this fascination with sticking plastic fake chrome on a 5 ? It looks gharsly and quite frankly shit

at the National rally the 2 grey non chromed mx5s didn’t get a look’in and didn’t get a top 3 place, when they clearly deserved it more than 2 of the mx5 that were in the top 3 

Why even have different catagories, why for instance have a lightly modified category when its appearance from the mods is not taken into account, the galaxy grey mx5 with its mods and cleanliness should have killed the competition 

I do hope that all the comments in this topic will be taken on board and that the show and shine competition in future rally’s will be dramatically improved from the shambles that it currently is

[iainf]

Please, that is going too far, this has to stop.

For 6 years I have been dragging our Club events up to the level we reached over this past weekend - and like clockwork after each event a lynch mob of disgruntled competitors turns up immediately after the event to trash the day, bemoan their position in the results or the execution of the Club Competitions or some other thing that was not to liking. Have you any idea how much this weekend took to deliver? all of the weekend for Free to members or any idea how disappointing it is to have sunk heart and soul into getting the events together, brought all the volunteers in on good spirits, seeing the joy created - and watch as all that can be said online is the like of this thread wrecking the day?

Over this same period there have been 4 people take the helm of the competitions and all leave - and that is largely down to the downright mean nature of the comments that come in. 

I have done all I can to put the car competitions front and centre of the events - I value highly the time, effort, energy and money it takes to put a car in to the competitions and to have these fantastic cars on show is a real spectacle for the day. In supporting this I have pursued many lines for competition development and we have been able to achieve things like sponsored prize categories that now facilitates fantastic trophies and sometimes prizes and gifts, Participation Certificates and rosettes where possible, duplicating score sheets so that copies of marks and comments can be left with you, signage to help identify the competitions, equipment to put the administration in - all of this has been incremental growth over the past few years for something that happens 2 days out of 365.

The rules and methods of the judging works - over several years there has been a massive amount of work with existing judges and competitors put into creating a judging system that allows for simple identification of issues to be noted rather than trying to score upwards, and that gives a consistent approach and direct feedback to the people competing, I have heard many people tackle the issues highlighted in the Spring and return to the National with it amended, as it should be to help improve and maintain cars.

Reading this thread I suggest that everyone read through these rules - as it is clearly evident that many have not including those who have competed and judged, despite them all being circulated to competitors well in advance, there are many answers already contained. As for running orders, the details were in the programme or where needed circulated to competitors before the event.

http://www.nationalrally.co.uk/uploads/1/2/4/4/12444453/car_competitions_judging_manual_v.2_jan_2015.pdf

This forensic picking apart and incendiary language after every event has to end - everyone talking part needs to Respect the Coordination, respect the volunteers, respect the judges, respect the rules and accept that those decisions are final to the event. 

Yes there are still some operational points that need addressed and I will be picking these up with the Competitions Coordinator in the Rally review at the Commitee’s meeting of 22 October.

 

I have asked for this thread to be locked now as it has lost it’s way and I ask you all to direct your comments good and bad directly to the Competitions coordinator by email - to allow him to build the picture of comments for the meeting. (remove the spaces around @)  Mal.Jones @ mx5oc.co.uk

Scores will be published in another thread and competitors should refer to their score sheets for the breakdown of the each judging section on their car.