E10 New Fuel Megathread [Consolidated for all E10 discussion]

Because, not having heard about it, I looked up about the new fuel and one article mentioned that E10 is pretty much fatal for any engine that has a carburettor, including lawn mowers.

When unleaded arrived we had to put an inline device on the fuel line of our Triumph 2000 to stop it pinking. Is there an equivalent for this for pre-2002 cars if super unleaded isn’t available?

And cast-iron in-head valve seats also failed.

I’d just rebuilt the engine in my 1977 Mk1 Cavalier 1600; from a four-year-old non-runner with 70k miles on the original oil filter (!) bought really cheap it was now immaculate.
BUT, 4K miles on six months of ‘New Formula’ Shell unleaded from my local garage burnt out the valve seats on both inlet AND exhaust valves on all cylinders. Steel inserts cured the problem.

Formula Shell… that is a blast from the past. One of the reasons I ignore all the ‘V-Power doubles my mpg and produce a zillion more horsepower’ type posts.

And to the ‘what if super unleaded is not available’ questions, you are missing the point. Superunleaded can be e10 as well. We are not concerned with octane rating, we are concerned with the chemicals used.

But I am pretty sure, and official statements have confirmed, that e5 will continue to be available. What is not clear is if e10 will be subsidised as an eco incentive (which those as cynical as me will read as e5 will be subject to an additional tax over normal fuel prices).

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This is interesting. The article I read suggested that super unleaded would be a solution - which I took to mean it would be staying at E5. (Maybe my mower won’t get the good stuff then…)

I think it’s 99.9% certain that the price of E5 will rise.

As I understated it the E5 protection grade fuel will probably be sold as a higher octane fuel i.e. like the existing Shell V-Power or BP Ultimate.

When I was having was having running issues with my wife’s Alpine I looked in to this ethanol lark and there are some additives like Millers VSPe power plus which has an octane booster, seat recession preventer and prevents ethanol corrosion, I actually work in an engine engineering company and we do have some which I did try out. However I also looked into the fuels and the only one that is listed as having no ethanol in it is Esso Synergy Supreme + 97 octane fuel. See below from Esso’s website.

The majority of unleaded 95 Octane petrol sold in the UK contains up to 5% ethanol as required under the Government’s Renewable Transport Fuels Obligation (RTFO).

There is currently no requirement for renewable fuel (such as ethanol) to be present in super unleaded (97 grade petrol).

Esso super unleaded petrol (Synergy Supreme+ Unleaded 97) is ethanol free (except in Devon, Cornwall, the Teesside area and Scotland). We would therefore advise anyone who has concerns about the presence of ethanol in petrol to use Synergy Supreme+ – providing they do not fill up in Devon or Cornwall, the Teesside area or Scotland.

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E10 has been boycotted by motorists in Germany for years due to damage caused to engines, I would stay well clear of the stuff.

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I guess some one will ask.
So it might as well be me. :slightly_smiling_face:
What “evidence” is that based on?
As according to to the attached guide all Mazda petrol engines are cleared to safely use E10 fuel built from the year 2002,(Mazda 6 engines as stated in it).
Likewise, “Many” others are also cleared to use it.
Not my opinion, just quoting the guide and information available on the net.
(Looks like I didn’t reply direct to Mx5argie1)?
For the record, I have no problems using E10 as the engine is built to use it, so why not. :man_shrugging:

When I started driving there was 3 star 4 star and 5 star and I belive before that there may well have been 2 star…well when they interduced unleaded that was the end for petrol engins…but here we are today…new fuel same comments diffrent generation

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There’s a sticker on the back of the petrol cap flap on my 30AE that says :-
Unleaded Premium, Min 95ron, E5, E10.
And in the handbooks for that and my 2015 ND it states:-
Unleaded Premium, min 95ron, within E10
I’ll go with that.

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Briggs & Stratton Fuel Fit additive “protects against the corrosive effects of ethanol” which is what I have used for years in my1987 Westwood ride on T1200/36 mower. My 2003 Honda HRH mower is treated with B&S Fuel Fit added to Sainsburys 95 Ron, which both mowers happily use & start first time. Note to Foolhandy

Fuel Fit also stabilises petrol which, according to my mower servicing guy, ensures that any fuel left in the system over Winter will result easy starting in the Spring.

I add Millers EcoMax petrol & diesel additives to the appropriate vehicles:-
MX5 2014 2 litre Sport tech Recaro 180+bhp Sainsburys 97 Ron
Eunos 1994 1.8 S Special 140+bhp VVT engine Sainsburys 97 Ron
(Millers also market an ethanol protective additive) see Wrinkly-Rovers posting.
Skoda Fabia 2014 1.6 TDi Monte Carlo Estate Sainsburys Regular diesel.
The Fabia has done 55K miles without any issues whatsoever. OF COURSE I NEVER HAD THE VAG EMISSIONS “FIX” this has caused all sorts of problems to many VAG diesel vehicles!!!
On the subject of VAG Emissions check out CHARLES LYNDON EMISSIONS this company is taking VAG to task.
Keith

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I sought out Synergy Supreme+ Unleaded 97 yesterday and the pump displayed an E5 sticker. This was in Nottingham (i.e. the middle of England) which makes me wonder if ethanol-free petrol is now a thing of the past.

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How typical that you can’t even trust the fuel manufacturer’s own website. Thanks for that, I’ll have to have a look down here in deepest darkest Essex, not for a while though as I’ve just filled up the ND and being a 1.5 sips fuel.

In my part of deepest darkest Essex all the pumps I’ve seen are E5 but as my ND’s are E5/E10 compatible it’s not worth worrying about.

I agree but I also have a year 2000 NB 1.6 on 25,000 mls which I may have to worry about if they do away with E5, although I would imagine it will be around for a few more years. I will then be too old to remember what to put in, I might even ask for two shots of 25:1 to put in. :grin:

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Almost all vehicles will suffer some negative impacts from E10, whether considered compatible or not.
Stay well away

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If an engine is “designed” to run on E10 fuel, what will be the negative impacts?
Firm evidence perhaps?
I have read “What can happen” if an engine NOT designed to run on it uses it long term.
Thanks.

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I lived ib Germany from 1986 and 1998 and have been going back quite often. E10 Petrol was introduced in 2006 there and it has hardly managed to get over 12.9% market share there.

I have found abn article from 2011 about the disadvantages of E10, the bottom line is: ethanol reduces the viscosity of the engine oil, water gets into the oil, and this leads to shorter oil change intervals, and long term damage to the engine, due to less oil viscosity. Further ethanol causes damage to the rubber seals.

The fact that E10’s market share is of 12.9 %, 14 years after introduction is a sign that motorists in Germany don’t trust it, even if it was cheaper than E5 petrol, however the price of E10 is almost the same as for E5. German Refineries have been scaling down the production of E10 due to low demand.

This is the link to the article, it is in German though:
Headline: E10 ruins motor oil and brings no benefits.

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Thanks for that. Interesting stuff. I hadn’t realised E10 had been on general sale in Germany for years. I found a few more current articles, like this one https://www.argusmedia.com/en/news/2121024-german-gasoline-retailers-price-e10-to-increase-sales and they say the same as you: customers just aren’t buying E10 because there’s no benefit to the individual. Sure, you get reduced greenhouse gas emissions and other pollution improvements if everyone uses it, but that’s an argument for everyone else to use it. What’s in it for me? Nothing but downside it appears. So the producers have now cut its price by about 4cents/litre because they have 6% reduction quotas to meet.

I guess it’s likely to be similar here then. If they offer both E5 and E10 at the pumps people aren’t going to choose the inferior fuel just because it’s slightly less damaging to the environment. Not without an incentive of some kind.

The majority of people won’t differentiate (on fuel knowledge), except if there is a few “p” difference.
It will be the equivalent of “social distancing” - some who know will, some who don’t, won’t!

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